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2006年股东大会 · 芒格:人类很难避免核战争的到来,最大的核威胁可能不来自恐怖分子

62 段 · 2 位说话人 · 原片 5:58
M1
M10:01

大家早上好。

Good morning.

我叫 Glenn Strong。

My name is Glenn Strong.

我来自 Ohio 的 Canton。

I'm from Canton, Ohio.

我是个乐观的人,我相信,要是聊 Chicago Cubs 怎么一路打进 World Series,肯定会更让人开心。

I'm an optimistic person, and I'm sure it would be more enjoyable to discuss the Chicago Cubs' march to the World Series.
M2
M20:16

你很乐观。

You are optimistic.

不过,正像有人评价 Cubs 时说的那样,谁都会时不时碰上一个糟糕的世纪。

But everybody has a bad century now and then, as somebody said about the Cubs.
M1
M10:31

不过,我在某个话题上信息不足,希望你们能帮我补上。

However, I have an information deficit on a certain topic that I hope you can fix.

请你们看看你们的水晶球。

Please gaze into your crystal ball.

作为投资者,我想知道该怎么应对美国发生核恐怖主义的风险。

As an investor, I want to know how to address the risk of nuclear terrorism in the United States.

设想这样一种情形:恐怖分子在美国某个大城市引爆了一枚核装置。

Consider a scenario where terrorists have detonated a nuclear device in a major U.S. city.

我知道,那会造成极其惨重的生命损失。

I know there would be a terrible cost in human lives.

两位先生,我们的经济会怎么样?

Gentlemen, what would happen to our economy?

它会怎么应对?

How would it respond?

它的韧性会有多强?

How resilient would it be?

谢谢。

Thank you.
M2
M21:12

嗯,那当然要看事情严重到什么程度了。不过如果你是在问,怎么从这种事里获利,我——大概会有某些交易商卖给你 mortality derivatives,不过,呃,我不太确定到那时候这会是我们在想的事情。

Well, it would certainly depend on the extent of it, but if you're asking how to profit from that, I—there's probably some dealer that will sell you mortality derivatives, but, uh, I'm not sure that's what we would be thinking about then.

不,我非常同意你——我再同意不过了,这确实是人类终极的问题。未必一定是恐怖分子式的使用,更可能是国家支持下对大规模杀伤性武器的使用。

No, I agree with you enorm— I couldn't agree with you more about that being the ultimate problem of mankind, not necessarily a terrorist-type usage of it, but a state-sponsored usage of weapons of mass destruction.

而且这总有一天会发生。

And it will happen someday.

至于会发生到什么程度,会在哪里发生,谁知道呢?

The extent to which it will happen, where it will happen, who knows?

但是——我觉得这是不可避免的。

But—I think it's inevitable.

邪恶的人一直都有。

We have always had evil people.

希望别人遭殃的人也一直都有。

We've always had people who wish evil on others.

你知道,几千年前,如果你是个精神错乱的人,或者宗教狂热分子,或者一个愤愤不平的人,你想对邻居作恶,那你就捡起一块石头朝他扔过去,那差不多也就是你能造成的伤害了。

And, you know, thousands of years ago, if you were psychotic or a religious fanatic or a malcontent and you wished evil on your neighbor, you picked up a rock and threw it at them, and that was about the damage you could do.

但后来我们有了弓箭、大炮,还有别的一些东西。

But we went on to bows and arrows and cannons and a few things.

但是自从一九四五年以来,对极其庞大数量的人造成巨大伤害的潜力,一直在以几何级数的速度增长。

But since 1945, the potential for inflicting enormous harm on incredible numbers of people has increased, you know, at a geometric pace.

所以,这就是全人类的问题。

So it is the problem of mankind.

它可能发生在这里,也可能发生在别的地方。

It may happen here, it may happen someplace else.

有些人说,这——有时候他们会说,嗯,你知道,如果我们解决了贫困问题,我们就能解决这个问题。

People say it's a—sometimes they say, well, you know, if we solve poverty, we'd solve this.

嗯,我只是想提醒你,核武器只被使用过两次,而那两次,都是一九四五年由世界上最富有的国家——美国——使用的。

Well, I would just remind you that nuclear weapons have only been used twice, and those were by the richest country in the world, the United States, in 1945.

所以,当人们觉得自己受到威胁时,在某些情况下,他们会为使用这种武器找到理由。

So people will justify their use under some circumstances if they feel threatened.

他们会用宗教上的理由来为这些事辩护。

They will justify them for religious reasons.

他们会干出各种疯狂的事情。

They will do all kinds of crazy things.

而且——真正能约束这件事的,是对怎么做这种事的知识缺乏在多大程度上还能被控制,对相关材料在多大程度上还能被控制,以及投送能力在多大程度上还能被控制。

And the— what holds it in check is the degree to which the lack of knowledge of how to do it is controlled, and the degree to which the materials are controlled, and the degree to which the deliverability is controlled.
M1
M13:08

对。

Yes.
M2
M23:10

被限制住。

Circumscribed.

可我们在所有这些方面都在节节后退。

And we're losing ground on all of those fronts.

这些知识已经传播得更广了。

The knowledge is more widespread.

拿到这些材料的可能性,你知道,像 Dr. Khan 这样的人物,还有类似的情况,都增加了。

The possibility of getting your hands on materials, you know, the Dr. Khans of the world and so on, has increased.

这会——这确实是个大问题,但到那一天,我们不会还在想着 Berkshire 那天在股市里做了什么。

And it will be— it's a real problem, but we won't be thinking about what Berkshire did that day in the stock market.

而且我不知道。

And I don't know.

我不知道,我不知道金钱能怎么解决这个问题。

I don't, I don't know how money attacks that.

我的意思是,我一直都觉得这才是头号优先事项。

I mean, I've always seen that as the top priority.

我觉得,对我个人来说,这也应该是 philanthropy 最该优先关注的事。

I think should be the top priority for philanthropy in my particular case.

但这很难——这非常难——这是个最坏情形的问题。

But it's a diff— it's a very difficult— it's a, it's a worst-case problem.

你想啊,世界上有六十亿人,其中总有一定比例的人,不管怎么说,是有点疯,或者非常疯;而他们当中的一些人,会把这种疯狂表现为试图对很多人造成巨大的伤害。

You know, you have 6 billion people in the world, you have a certain percentage of them who are one way or another a little crazy or very crazy, and some of whom— and that craziness would manifest itself by trying to do great harm to a lot of people.

而且,呃,只要他们里面有一个人成功就够了。

And it's, uh, only one of them has to succeed.

我不知道这些年我们拦下了多少次。

I don't know how many we've intercepted over the years.

我敢肯定,我们拦下了很多还处在萌芽阶段的行动,但是,这终究是个最坏情形的问题,而且,迟早会有一个成功。

I'm sure intercepted a lot of incipient ones, but, but it is a worst-case problem, and, and one will succeed at some point.

而且也许是国家支持的,也许是恐怖分子干的,不过,你知道,Berkshire——

And maybe state-sponsored, it may be terrorists, but, you know, Berkshire.

它或许比任何别人都更有条件活下来,但也不会有太大差别。

It's better set to survive than anybody else, but it won't make much difference.

Charlie?

Charlie?

嗯,我觉得,我们还能再有六十年或者七十年、期间没有核装置被故意使用,这种可能性基本接近于零。

Well, I think that the chances we'll have another 60 or 70 years with no nuclear devices used on purpose is pretty close to zero.

所以我觉得你担心这个是对的,但我——就我个人来说,我不觉得我们任何人能为这件事做太多,除了尽可能理性一点,然后后果来了就承受。

So I think you're right to worry about it, but I don't— myself, I think there's much that any of us can do about it except to be as sensible as we can and take the consequences as they come.

你唯一能做的事——但你也只有一张选票——就是选出那些对这个问题极其有警觉、并且愿意投入相当一部分思考和精力去尽量降低这种风险的领导人。

The only thing you can do about it, but you only have one vote, is to elect leaders who are terribly conscious of the problem and who devote a significant, you know, part of their thought and energy into minimizing it.

你没法彻底消除它。

You can't eliminate it.

你知道,魔鬼已经从瓶子里放出来了。

You know, the genie is out of the bottle.

而你会希望,世界主要国家的领导人都把这件事当成他们最主要的——至少是一个主要关注点。

And you would like to have the leading— the leaders of the major countries of the world regarding it as their primary— as a primary focus.

其实,在二零零四年的竞选里,我记得两位候选人都说,这是我们这个时代最重大的问题。

Actually, in the 2004 campaign, I think that both candidates said it was the major problem of our time.

但是——

But—.
M1
M15:51

但是——

But—.
M2
M25:51

但是,你知道,他们可能也跟我有同样的感觉,就是这件事真的很难去处理。

But, you know, they probably suffer from the same feeling that I do, that it's very hard to address.

第六个。

Number 6.