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2000年股东大会 · 芒格名言:把葡萄干和屎搅在一起,你得到的还是屎

52 段 · 3 位说话人 · 原片 5:44
M1
M10:00

早上好,先生们。

Good morning, gentlemen.

我是 Wayne Peters。

Wayne Peters.

在我们那儿,我们会把女士称作 birds。

And where I come from, our ladies are referred to as birds.

我敢肯定,我认识很多人,不管利率是多少,都会愿意拿手里的一只去换林子里的两只。

And I'm sure I know a lot that would trade one in the hand for two in the bush, irrespective of the interest rate.

我有两个小问题。

I have two small questions.

第一,关于 high-tech 和 internet 领域里的投机,有些人会说已经到了疯狂投机的程度,您能不能谈谈,您觉得这种投机可能会给整体经济带来什么后果?

Firstly, with the speculation, and some would say rampant speculation, in the high-tech and internet arenas, could you share your views on the potential fallout from this speculation for the general economy?

第二,您到底花了多久才把那个 curveball 练到那么完美?我们今晚能看到吗?

And secondly, how long did it actually take you to perfect that curveball, and are we going to see it tonight?
M2
M20:53

这个,呃,我觉得我今晚的投球可不想先泄底。

The, uh, I don't think I want to give anything away about my pitches tonight.

Ernie Banks 说不定就在观众席里。

Ernie Banks may be in the audience.

我知道他人在城里,所以我实在不能这么干。

I know he's in town, and I just can't afford to do that.

不过你今晚会看到的,至于怎么形容,随你。

But you'll see it tonight, and you can describe it any way you'd like.

关于 high-tech 股票和可能带来的后果这个问题。

The question about the high-tech stocks and possible fallout.

呃,只要市场上真的出现过这种投机狂潮,你知道,最后总是会被纠正的。

Uh, anytime there have been real bursts of speculation in the market, you know, it does get corrected eventually.

Ben Graham 说得对,短期来看,市场是一台投票机;长期来看,市场是一台称重机。

Ben Graham was right when he said that in the short run it's a voting machine, in the long run it's a weighing machine.

迟早,一家公司未来究竟能吐出多少现金,才决定了它的股票在市场上能值多少钱。

Sooner or later, the amount of cash that a business can disgorge in the future governs the value that the stock commands in the market.

不过这可能要花很长时间。

But it can take a long time.

我是说,这其实是个很有意思的命题。

And I mean, it's a very interesting proposition.

比如说,如果你拿一家公司来说,它到头来根本赚不到钱,但它在一段时间里交易时体现出来的估值却有一百亿或者两百亿美元,那并没有创造出任何财富。

For example, if you take a company that in the end never makes any money, but that changes hands representing a valuation of $10 or $20 billion for some time, there's no wealth created.

只是有巨额财富被转移了。

There's a tremendous amount of wealth transferred.

我觉得,等我们回头看这个时代的时候,你会发现,这是一个发生了巨量财富转移的时期。

And I think you will see, when we look back on this era, you will see this as a period of enormous amounts of wealth transfer.

但归根结底,真正的财富创造,只能来自企业本身创造了什么。

But in the end, the only wealth creation comes about through what the business creates.

这里头没有什么魔法。

There's no magic to it.

如果一家根本不值钱的公司却卖到两百亿美元,而且其中百分之五换了手,那就是有人从别人那里拿走了十亿美元。

If a company that's not worth anything sells for $20 billion and 5% of it changes hands, somebody takes $1 billion from somebody else.
M1
M12:34

对。

Right.
M2
M22:37

但就整体而言,投资者并没有得到任何好处。

But investors as a whole gain nothing.

他们都会觉得自己更有钱了。

They all feel richer.

这是个很有意思的现象,但除非这家公司真的让他们变得更有钱,否则他们作为一个整体,其实不可能更富有。

It's a very interesting phenomenon, but they can't be richer except as a group unless the company makes them richer.

这和 chain letter 的原理是一样的。

And it's the same principle as a chain letter.

我的意思是,如果你很早就参与进 chain letter,你是能赚到钱的。

I mean, if you're very early on a chain letter, you can make money.

但 chain letter 本身并不会创造出任何财富。

There's no money created by chain letters.

其实,这里面还有信封、邮资之类的摩擦成本。

In fact, there's the frictional cost of envelopes and postage and that sort of thing.

所以算到最后,还是会有一点钱被消耗掉。

So in the net, there's some money destroyed a little bit.
M1
M13:01

对。

Right.
M2
M23:02

而且,交易和投资过程中的摩擦成本,也会造成资金损耗。

And there's money destroyed by the frictional costs of trading and investing.

这些钱最后都是从投资者口袋里出的。

That comes out of investors' pockets.

不过,周期性出现的那些狂热,不只是发生在股票上——我们也经历过类似的狂热——也不一定算完全类似吧,反正二十年前,我们 Nebraska 这里的农地就确实出现过一场狂热。

But the manias that periodically take place, and not just in stocks—we had a similar mania—I'm not necessarily similar, we certainly had a mania in farmland here in Nebraska 20 years ago.
M1
M13:28

对。

Yeah.
M2
M23:29

有些地每英亩能产出的收益,我们就说,不会超过七十到八十美元,可在某些时候,利率都到百分之十了,它每英亩还能卖到两千美元。

And land which couldn't produce, we'll say, more than $70 or $80 an acre would sell for $2,000 an acre at times when interest rates were 10%.

这笔账会要命的,而它也确实害惨了那些按这个价格买地的人,也害惨了 Nebraska 这里很多按这种逻辑放贷的银行。

Well, that, that math will kill you, and it killed the people who bought it at those prices, and it killed a great many banks here in Nebraska who lent based on that sort of thing.

但在事情进行的时候,大家都觉得特别美好,因为每一块农场卖出的价格,都比一个月前类似农场的成交价更高。

But while it was going on, everybody thought it was wonderful because every farm was selling for more than the similar farm had sold for a month earlier.

这就是农地上的 momentum investing。

And it was momentum investing in farmland.

但到头来,估值终究还是重要的,只不过这种情况可以持续很久。

And in the end, valuation does, does count, but it can go on a long time.

当有大量参与者,拿着越来越多的钱不断往里玩的时候,你知道,这种东西会自己制造出一种看上去像真的“真相”,而且这个状态可能持续相当长一段时间。

And when you get a, when you get a huge number of participants playing with ever-increasing sums, you know, it creates its own apparent truth for a—can be for a very considerable period of time.

但它不会永远持续下去。

It doesn't go on forever.

至于它最后是会像二十年代末那样,可能对整个经济都造成冲击,还是说只是某个独立行业——或者某个板块——泡沫破掉了,但其实并不会影响到其他资产价值,嗯,这谁也说不好。

And, and whether it, whether it has fallout to the whole economy like it probably did in the, in the late '20s, or whether it's just an isolated industry where the—or, or sector where the bubble bursts and it really doesn't affect other values, uh, who knows.

不过,五年或者十年以后,你就会知道了。

Uh, but 5 or 10 years from now, you will know.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M3
M34:47

嗯,我觉得我们之所以用“wretched excess”这个说法,是因为它会带来很糟糕的后果。

Well, I think the reason we use the phrase wretched excess is that there are wretched consequences.

如果你把连锁信或者 Ponzi scheme 那套数学,和某些正当的发展混在一起,比如 internet 的发展,那你其实就是把一种糟糕的、非理性的、会带来坏结果的东西,和一种会带来很好结果的东西混在了一起。

If you mix the mathematics of the chain letter or the Ponzi scheme with some legitimate development, like the development of the internet, you are mixing something which is wretched and irrational and has bad consequences with something that has very good consequences.

但你知道,要是把葡萄干和屎搅在一起,那它还是屎。

But you know, if you mix raisins with turds, they're still turds.
M2
M25:31

所以他们才让我来写年报。

That's why they have me write the annual report.

那我看我们最好还是进入第三部分吧。

So I think we better move on to Section 3.