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2019年伯克希尔股东大会问答集锦(中文字幕)

508 段 · 3 位说话人 · 原片 64:04
M1
M10:00

除了 Berkshire Hathaway 之外,你做过的最有意思或者最好玩的个人投资是什么?

Outside of Berkshire Hathaway, what is the most interesting or fun personal investment you have ever made?

嗯,这种事嘛,通常都是你从里面赚了很多钱的时候,才总是更好玩。

Well, they're always, they're always more fun when you make a lot of money off of them.

嗯,我有一次买过股票。

Well, I bought stock one time.

我买的是 Atled。

I bought Atled.

我买了 Atled Corp. 的一股股票。拼法是 A-T-L-E-D。Atled 当时一共流通了九十八股,我买了一股。

One share of stock in the Atled Corp. That's spelled A-T-L-E-D. And Atled had 98 shares outstanding, and I bought one.

而且这可不是那种你会叫做流动性很好的证券。

And not what you call a liquid security.

Atled 其实就是 Delta 倒过来拼。St. Louis 有一百个人,每个人凑了五十到一百美元左右,在 Louisiana 组了一个打野鸭的俱乐部,他们还在那边买了些地。

And Atled happened to be the word Delta spelled backwards, and 100 guys in St. Louis had each chipped in $50 or $100 or something to form a duck club in Louisiana, and they bought some land down there.

其中有两个人没拿出他们该出的那份——总共是一百个人,其中两个人没履行拿出一百美元的义务,所以最后流通股就是九十八股。

Two guys didn't come up with their— there were 100 of them, two of them defaulted on their obligation to come up with $100, so there were 98 shares out.

后来他们去了 Louisiana,打了些鸭子,不过显然有人朝地上开了几枪,结果石油就喷出来了。

And they went down to Louisiana, and they shot some ducks, but apparently somebody shot, fired a few shots into the ground, and oil spurted out.

那些 Delta Duck Club 的股份——我想 Delta Duck Club 那块油田现在应该还在生产——我是在四十年前买的,每股两万九千二百美元。它当时账上就有那么多现金,而且产量很高,后来他们把它卖掉了。

And those Delta Duck Club shares, and there's, I think the Delta Duck Club field is still producing, but I bought stock in it 40 years ago for $29,200 a share, and it was, it had that amount in cash, and it was producing a lot, and they sold it.

要是他们一直留着,那只股票现在每股可能值两三百万美元,不过他们后来卖给了另一家石油公司。

If they kept it, that stock might have been worth $2 or $3 million a share, but they sold out to another oil company.

不过那肯定是最有意思的一笔。

But that was certainly the most interesting thing.

其实,我当时手里根本没现金,所以我还特地下去借了钱。

Actually, I didn't have any cash at the time, and I went down and borrowed the money.

我是替我太太买的,我借了那笔钱,结果贷款专员还问我,要不要顺便再借点钱买一把 shotgun?

I bought it for my wife, and I borrowed the money, and the loan officer said, would you like to borrow some money to buy a shotgun as well?

Charlie,跟他们讲讲你错过的那一笔。

Charlie, tell them about the one you missed.
M2
M22:23

嗯,我能想到两笔投资。

Well, I can have two investments that come to mind.

我年轻又穷的时候,有一次花了一千美元买了一笔 oil royalty,后来很多很多年里,它每年都给我带来十万美元收入。

When I was young and poor, I spent $1,000 once buying an oil royalty that paid me $100,000 a year for a great many years.

不过这种事,我一辈子也就碰上那么一次。

But I only did that once in a lifetime.

后来还有一次,我买了几股 Eldridge Oil,很快就涨了三十倍,不过——我当时拒绝买的数量,其实是我后来买入数量的五倍。

On a later occasion, I bought a few shares of Eldridge Oil, which went up 30 times rather quickly, and— but I turned down five times as much as I bought.

那是我这辈子做过最蠢的决定。

It was the dumbest decision of my whole life.

所以如果你们谁做过什么蠢决定,就看看台上,然后对自己感觉好一点。

So if any of you have made any dumb decisions, look up here and feel good about yourselves.

对。

Yeah.

你们好,Charlie Munger 和 Warren Buffett,我的偶像。

Hello, Charlie Munger and Warren Buffett, my idols.

我是来自 Shanghai GeorG P Fund 的 Terry,我们的目标是在这个时代抓住最好的投资机会。

I'm Terry from Shanghai GeorG P Fund, which aims to catch the best investment opportunity in that era.

所以我的问题是,我们都知道,5G 要来了。

So my question is, as we all know, 5G is coming.

据说在 5G 时代,所有行业的模式都会受到挑战。

It is said that the mode of all industry will be challenged in the 5G era.

那么,如果 Berkshire Hathaway 想在这个时代抓住最好的投资机会,我们应该掌握的核心竞争力是什么?

So what is the core competence that we should master if Berkshire Hathaway wants to catch the best investment opportunities in this era?

谢谢。

Thank you.
M1
M13:50

嗯,在 Berkshire 的最高层,其实并没有什么核心竞争力。

Well, there's no core competence at the very top of Berkshire.

不过我们——

But we—.

那些会涉及到跟 5G 相关的发展,或者这个世界接下来会发生的各种事情的子公司——比如说,LNG 在铁路里的应用,或者诸如此类的问题——我们在那些业务里都有一些人,他们比我们更懂这些。

The subsidiaries that will be involved in developments relating to 5G or any one of all kinds of things that are going to happen in this world, you know, the utility of LNG in the railroad or all those kinds of questions, we have people in those businesses that know a lot more about them than we do.

这个嘛,你知道,我们是指望我们的经理人去预判他们各自业务里接下来会发生什么的,然后他们有时候也会来跟我们聊这些。

And this is, you know, we count on our managers to anticipate what is coming in their business, and then sometimes they talk to us about it.

但我们不是用一种集中的方式来管理这些事。

But we do not run that on a centralized basis.

Charlie,你有什么想补充的吗?

And Charlie, do you want to have anything to add to that?

你对 5G 了解吗?

Do you know anything about 5G?

我不知道。

I don't know.

嗯,你大概还是挺了解 5G 的。

Well, you probably know a lot about 5G.
M2
M24:52

不,我对 5G 了解得非常少。

No, I know very little about 5G.

不过我对 China 倒是有一点了解,我们也在 China 买过一些东西,我猜以后还会买更多。

But I do know a little about China, and we have bought things in China, and my guess is we'll buy more.
M1
M15:09

对。

Yeah.

不过我的意思是,我们基本上就是希望有一批经理人,而我们也确实有这么一批经理人,他们对自己的业务都了如指掌。

But I mean, we basically want to have a group of managers, and we do have a group of managers who are on top of their businesses.

我的意思是,你刚才看到展示里有 BNSF、Berkshire Hathaway Energy,还有 Lubrizol,都在那儿。

I mean, you saw something that showed BNSF and Berkshire Hathaway Energy and Lubrizol all there.

那些人懂他们自己的业务。

Those people know their businesses.

他们知道前面大概率会有哪些变化。

They know what changes are likely to be ahead.

有时候他们会发现彼此业务之间可以合作的地方,但我们不会试图在总部去指挥这些事。

Sometimes they find things that they can cooperate on between their businesses, but we don't try to run those from headquarters.

这可能也意味着,我们在某些时候会有一些弱点。

And that may mean that we have certain weaknesses at certain times.

但总体算下来,我觉得这对 Berkshire 来说是个非常大的好处。

I think net, it's been a terrific benefit for Berkshire.

我们的经理人在很大程度上,真的是把自己的业务当成自己的事业来经营,我们也希望他们有这种主人翁的感觉。

Our managers, to a great degree, own their businesses, and we want them to feel a sense of ownership.

我们不希望他们淹没在某个庞大的 conglomerate 里,变成谁也说不上来——今天从这个小组接指令,那个小组又隶属于另一个小组。

We don't want them to be lost in some massive conglomerate and nobody— where they get directions from this group, which is a subgroup of that group.

我还能给你讲几个我们收购过的公司里的恐怖故事,他们跟我们讲过自己在这种运作体系下面的经历。

And I could tell you a few horror stories from companies we bought when they tell us about their experience under such an operation.

所以我们——

So we—

这个世界会以非常戏剧性的方式发生变化。

The world is going to change in dramatic ways.

你就想想,在我们拥有 Berkshire 的这五十四年里,它已经变了多少,而其中有些变化是伤害过我们的。

Just think how much it's changed in the 54 years that we've had Berkshire, and some of those changes hurt us.

它们伤害过我们在纺织业上的业务。

They hurt us in textiles.

也伤害过我们在制鞋业上的业务。

They hurt us in shoes.

还伤害过我们在百货商店业务上的经营。

They hurt us in the department store business.

也伤害过我们在 trading stamp 业务上的经营。

Hurt us in the trading stamp business.

这些都是我们这套体系最早的创始业务,但我们会调整,而且整体上我们现在拥有的是一批非常好的业务。

These were the founding businesses of this operation, but we do adjust, and we've got a group overall of very good businesses.

我们里面也有一些业务,实际上会被这个世界发生的变化所摧毁。

We've got some that will be actually destroyed by what happens in this world.

但那就是,你知道,我依然是个坚定的资本主义者,我相信这是一件好事。

But that's, you know, I still am the card-carrying capitalist, and I believe that that's a good thing.

你必须做出改变。

You have to make changes.

一八零零年的时候,我们有百分之八十的人都在农场干活;要是后来没有发生很多变化,而且国家里还得靠百分之八十的人来生产我们需要的食物和棉花,那我们的社会就会完全是另一副样子。

We had 80% of the people working on farms in 1800, and if there hadn't been a lot of changes and you needed 80% of the people in the country producing the food and cotton we needed, we would have a whole different society.

我们欢迎变化,当然也希望我们的经理人能够预判变化并适应变化;但有时候我们也会看错,那些企业就会逐渐衰落、消亡,那我们最好就把钱用到别的地方去。

We welcome change, and we certainly want to have managers that can anticipate and adapt to it, but sometimes we'll be wrong, and those businesses will wither and die, and we better use the money someplace else.

这个问题来自 Indianapolis 的 Ken Squireback。

This question is from Ken Squireback in Indianapolis.

他说,完全明白 Warren 没有参与 Amazon 这笔买入,而且相对于 Berkshire 来说,这很可能只是个小仓位,但这项投资还是让我有点意外。

He says, with the full understanding that Warren had no input on the Amazon purchase and that relative to Berkshire, it's likely a small stake, the investment still caught me off guard.

我在想,展望未来二十年,我是不是应该开始用不同的方式来看 Berkshire。

I'm wondering if I should begin to think differently about Berkshire looking out, say, 20 years.

我们会不会正在看到一种投资理念上的转变,开始偏离现有管理层七十年来一直践行的 value investing 原则?

Might we be seeing a shift in investment philosophy away from value investing principles that the current management has practiced for 70 years?

Amazon 是一家很棒的公司,但在牛市已经持续了十年之后,它那种高高在上的股价,看起来似乎和“别人贪婪时要恐惧”这句话有点冲突。

Amazon is a great company, yet it would seem its heady shares 10 years into a bull market appear to conflict with being fearful when others are greedy.

考虑到这一点,以及像 StoneCo 这样的其他一些近期投资,我们是不是该为价格和价值判断方式的变化做准备——挺有意思的是,你提到了 value investing 这个词,因为我可以向你保证,那两位经理——

Considering this and other recent investments like StoneCo, should we be preparing for a change in the price versus value decisions that— It's interesting that the term value investing came up because I can assure you that both managers who—

其中一位在上个季度买了一些 Amazon 的股票,这个会在再过一周到十天的报告里披露——他就是个 value investor。

And one of them bought some Amazon stock in the last quarter, which will get reported in another week or 10 days— he is a value investor.

认为价值 somehow 是和 book value、或者低市盈率之类的东西绑定在一起,这种想法——正如 Charlie 说的,所有投资本质上都是 value investing。

The idea that value is somehow connected to book value or low price-earnings ratios or anything, as Charlie has said, all investing is value investing.

我的意思是,你现在拿出一些钱,是为了以后拿回更多的钱;而你要做的,就是去判断拿到这些钱的概率、你会在什么时候拿到,以及这中间的利率会是什么样。

I mean, you're putting out some money now to get more later on, and you're making a calculation as to the probabilities of getting that money and when you'll get it and what interest rates will be in between.

不管你买的是一家按 book value 七折交易的银行,还是按非常高的已披露盈利倍数买入 Amazon,背后的计算其实都是一样的。

And all the same calculation goes into it whether you're buying some bank at 70% of book value or you're buying Amazon at some very high multiple of reported earnings.

对于 Amazon——做出 Amazon 投资决定的人,绝对和当年我到处找那些股价低于 working capital 的公司时一样,都是 value investor。

Amazon— the people making the decision on Amazon are absolutely as much value investors as I was when I was looking around for all these things selling below working capital years ago.

所以这一点并没有变。

So that has not changed.

那两个人里——其中一位做了 Amazon 这笔投资——他们在看的是几百只证券,而且因为他们管理的钱比我少,所以他们能看的范围比我更大,可选标的也更多。

The two people that— one of whom made the investment in Amazon— they are looking at many hundreds of securities, and they can look at more than I can because they're managing less money and their universe, possible universe, is greater.

但他们寻找的,都是那些他们认为自己能够理解、并且能判断从现在到 Judgment Day 之间,这家公司最终会产生多少现金的东西。

But they are looking for things that they feel they understand what will be developed by that business between now and Judgment Day in cash.

这和销售额有关——当前销售额会有一些影响。

And it's not sales, current sales can make some difference.

当前利润率也会有一些影响。

Current profit margins can make some difference.

有形资产、过剩现金、过多债务,所有这些因素都会放进计算里,来判断他们应该买 A 还是 B,还是 C。而且他们绝对是在遵循价值原则。

Tangible assets, excess cash, excess debt, all of those things go into making a calculation as to whether they should buy A versus B versus C. And they are absolutely following value principles.

他们不一定彼此认同,也不一定和我意见一致,但他们都非常聪明。

They don't necessarily agree with each other or agree with me, but they are very smart.

他们对 Berkshire 是全心投入的,而且除此之外,他们还是非常好的人。

They are totally committed to Berkshire, and they're very good human beings on top of it.

所以我不会对他们的任何决定事后指指点点。

So I don't second-guess them on anything.

Charlie 也不会对我事后指点——六十年来,他从来没有对我的任何一笔投资事后指手画脚。

Charlie doesn't second-guess me on— in 60 years, he's never second-guessed me on an investment.

而且,无论你买的是 Amazon,还是比如说某只从 book value、盈利之类统计指标上看起来很便宜的银行股,考虑的因素其实完全一样。

And the considerations are identical when you buy Amazon versus some, say, bank stock that looks cheap statistically against book value or earnings or something of the sort.

归根结底,一切都可以追溯到 Aesop。公元前六百年,他就说过这么一句话:一鸟在手,胜过双鸟在林。

In the end, it all goes back to Aesop, who in 600 BC said, you know, that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

当我们买 Amazon 的时候,我们会努力搞清楚——或者说买它的那位同事会努力搞清楚——那片树林里到底是有三只、四只还是五只鸟;要多久才能走到那片树林;他有多大把握自己能走到那里;还有,会不会有别人跑来把那片树林抢走,诸如此类。

And when we buy Amazon, we try and figure out whether— or the fellow that bought it tries to figure out whether there's three or four or five in the bush and how long it'll take to get to the bush, how certain he is that he's going to get to the bush, you know, and then who else is going to come and try and take the bush away and all of that sort of thing.

我们做的都是同样的事。其实,不管你在商学院会学到多少公式,最根本的公式还是 Aesop 的那个公式。而你投资能不能成功,取决于你多大程度上能判断清楚那片树林到底有多确定、离你有多远,以及最坏的情况是什么。

And we do the same thing, and it really, despite a lot of equations you'll learn in business school, the basic equation is that of Aesop, and your success in investing depends on how well you were able to figure out how certain that bush is, how far away it is, and what the worst case is.

比如说,本来以为那儿有两只鸟,结果其实只有一只;当然也有可能那儿有四只、五只、十只,甚至二十只。

Instead of two birds being there, only one being there, and the possibilities of four or five or ten or twenty being there.

这会指引我,也会指引我在 Berkshire 负责投资管理的继任者们;而且我相信,他们做对的时候会比做错的时候更多。

And that will guide me, that will guide my successors in investment management at Berkshire, and I think they'll be right more often than they're wrong.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M2
M212:41

嗯,Warren 和我比有些人年纪要大一点,而且——

Well, Warren and I are a little older than some people, and—.
M1
M112:48

对,差不多比所有人都大。

Yeah, near everybody.
M2
M212:51

而且我们大概也不是全世界最灵活的那种人。

And we're not the most flexible, probably, in the whole world.

当然了,要是像互联网发展这种这么极端的变化发生了,而你又没抓住,那别人就会从你身边呼啸而过。

And of course, if something as extreme as this internet development happens and you don't catch it, why, other people are going to blow by you.

不过,我倒不介意自己当初没有早早看出 Amazon。

And I don't mind not having caught Amazon early.

那家伙简直有点像个奇迹创造者。

The guy is kind of a miracle worker.

这事挺奇特的。

It's very peculiar.

这一点上,我就放自己一马。

I give myself a pass on that.

但是,没能更早识别出 Google,我就觉得自己蠢透了。

But I feel like a horse's ass for not identifying Google better.

我觉得 Warren 也是一样的感觉。

I think Warren feels the same way.

对,我们搞砸了。

Yeah, we screwed up.
M1
M113:29

他的意思是,我们失手了。

He's saying we blew it.

对,我们其实对此也是有一些判断的,因为我们当时在 GEICO 用他们的服务,也看到了产生的效果。我们看到自己每次点击要付十美元,或者差不多这个数,而对他们来说边际成本正好是零。我们也看到这对我们确实有效,所以——

Yeah, and we did have some insights into that because we were using them at GEICO, and we were seeing the results produced, and we saw that we were paying $10 a click or whatever it might have been for something that at a marginal cost to them was exactly zero, and we saw it was working for us, so—.
M2
M213:53

我们从自己的业务运营里就能看出来,Google 的广告效果有多好,可我们就是坐在那儿干瞪眼。

We could see in our own operations how well that Google advertising was working, and we just sat there sucking our thumbs.

所以我们挺惭愧的。

So we're ashamed.

我们认错补过。

We atone.

我们正在努力补过。

We're trying to atone.

也许 Apple 就算是一种补偿吧。

Maybe Apple was atonement.
M1
M114:14

他说坐在那儿干瞪眼的时候,我还挺庆幸他没举别的例子。

When he says sucking our thumbs, I'm just glad he didn't use some other example.

好,Jay。

Okay, Jay.

嗨,Warren 和 Charlie。

Hey, Warren and Charlie.

我叫 Neil Narona。

I'm Neil Narona.

我十三岁,来自 San Francisco。

I'm 13 years old and from San Francisco.

我感觉我经常在我们家客厅里见到你们。

I feel like I see you in our living room a lot.

我爸爸老是在放你们这些会议上的视频。

My dad is constantly playing these videos of you at these meetings.
M2
M214:48

他也教了我很多关于你们的人生道理,不过其中很多都需要一种延迟满足的能力。

And he teaches me a lot of lessons about you guys, but many of them require the delayed gratification skill.

我想知道,小孩子有没有什么办法培养延迟满足的能力?

I want to know, is there any way that kids can develop the delayed gratification skill?

如果你想让我来答,Warren,我可以答这个。

I'll take it if you want me to, Warren.

这个我来答吧,因为我是延迟满足方面的专家。

I'll take that because I'm a specialist in delayed gratification.

我花了很多时间想这个问题,我的答案是,他们某种程度上就是天生会延迟满足。

I've had a lot of time to think about it, and my answer is that they sort of come out of the womb with the delayed gratification thing.

或者说,他们天生就是那种什么都得马上要的人,而我从来没法把他们改变过来。

Or they come out of the womb where they have to have everything right now, and I've never been able to change them at all.

所以我们只能把这种人识别出来,但没法把他们扭转过来。

So we identify it, we don't turn it in.
M1
M115:51

Charlie 有八个孩子,所以他现在越来越相信,人的天性比后天培养更重要。

Charlie's had eight children, so he's become more and more of a believer in nature versus nurture.
M2
M216:00

你大概会在外面看到某个九十五岁左右、穿得很破旧的老太太,她这一辈子都在延迟满足,而且很可能还持有四千股 A shares。

You'll probably find some nice old woman of about 95 out there in threadbare clothing, and she's delaying gratification right to the end and probably has 4,000 A shares.

反倒是这些第二代、第三代的人,在买那些老珠宝。

It's just these second- and third-generation types that are buying old jewelry.
M1
M116:20

这事挺有意思的,如果你把它放大一点来看——我们说得更广一点——假设一只三十年期的 government bond 收益率是百分之三,而你作为个人,还得为这百分之三交一些税,同时 Federal Reserve Board 还会说,他们的目标是把通胀维持在百分之二。

It's interesting if you think about—we'll take it to a broader point—but if you think of a 30-year government bond paying 3%, and you allow for, as an individual, paying some taxes on the 3% you'll receive, and you'll have the Federal Reserve Board saying that their objective is to have 2% inflation.

你就会真的看到,如果你持有长期 government bond,所谓延迟满足其实就是,三十年后你去 Disneyland,能坐的项目数量,跟你现在去基本是一样的。

You'll really see that delayed gratification, if you own a long government bond, is that, you know, you get to go to Disneyland and ride the same number of rides 30 years from now that you would if you did it now.

对于投资固定美元回报产品的人来说,低利率真正意味着,你现在吃 hamburger,之后可未必能换来以后吃 steak;可我很多年前一直就是这么跟我太太、孩子,还有任何愿意听的人讲的。

The low interest rates for people who invest in fixed-dollar investments really mean that you really aren't going to, you know, get—have to eat steak later on if you eat hamburgers now, which is what I used to preach to my wife and children and anybody else that would listen many years ago.

所以这就是——

So it's—

我并不觉得,对所有家庭、在所有情况下,存钱就一定是人生中最好的做法。

I don't necessarily think that for all families in all circumstances, that saving money is necessarily the best thing to do in life.

我的意思是,如果你真的跟孩子说,不管是什么吧,他们永远不能去看电影,或者永远不能去 Disneyland 之类的,就因为“如果我把这笔钱省下来,三十年后我们就能住一个星期,而不是两天”。

I mean, you know, if you really tell your kids they can, whatever it may be, they never go to the movies or never go to Disneyland or something of the sort, because if I save this money, 30 years from now, you know, we'll be able to stay a week instead of two days.

我觉得,与其想方设法省下每一分钱,不如去做一些能给你和家人带来快乐的事情,这其实很有道理。

I think there's a lot to be said for doing things that bring you and your family enjoyment rather than trying to save every dime.

所以,延迟满足未必是坏事。

So, delayed gratification is not necessarily a bad thing.

也不是说在任何情况下都可以不加区分地这么做。

An unqualified course of action under all circumstances.

我一直相信,每赚一美元,花掉两三美分,剩下的都存起来。

I always believed in spending two or three cents out of every dollar I earned, saving the rest.

但说真的,我一直都拥有我想要的一切。

But I really, I've always had everything I wanted.

我是说,有一点你们应该明白:如果你有五万、或者十万美元的时候都不快乐,那你有五千万、或者一亿美元的时候,也不会快乐。

I mean, one thing you should understand: if you aren't happy having $50,000 or $100,000, you're not going to be happy if you have $50 million or $100 million.

当然,一定数量的钱,的确会让你自己、也让你身边的人感觉更好一些,至少在某些情况下会更有安全感。

I mean, a certain amount of money does make you feel, and those around you feel, better, just in terms of being more secure in some cases.

但是很多很多钱——我认识的有钱人大概不比任何人少——我并不认为他们只是因为变得超级有钱就更快乐了。

But loads and loads of money—I've probably known as many rich people as just about anybody—and I don't think they're happier because they get super rich.

我觉得,当他们不用为钱发愁的时候,确实会更快乐一些;但过了某个点以后,你看不到幸福和金钱之间还有什么对应关系。

I think they are happier when they don't have to worry about money, but you don't see a correlation between happiness and money beyond a certain point.

所以,别在延迟满足这件事上走得太过头。

So don't go overboard on delayed gratification.

大家好,我是来自 San Francisco 的 Jeff Malloy,这是我第一次参加股东大会。

Hi, I'm Jeff Malloy from San Francisco, and this is my first shareholders meeting.

Buffett 先生、Munger 先生,我今年二十七岁,希望有一天能像你们两位一样,成为出色的资金管理人。

Mr. Buffett and Mr. Munger, I'm 27 years old and aspire to be a great money manager like you two one day.

我正在考虑自己成立一个投资基金。

I am considering starting my own investment fund.

但我也知道,我还年轻,还有很多东西要学。

But I also recognize that I am young and have a lot to learn.

我想问二位的是,你们当年是怎么判断自己已经准备好去管理别人的钱了?还有,对于像我这样的人,你们会给什么样的总体建议?

My question to both of you is, how did you know you were ready to manage other people's money, and what general advice would you give to someone in my shoes?

谢谢。

Thank you.

嗯,这是个非常有意思的问题。

Well, it's a very interesting question.

因为我也面对过这个问题,而且我有一段时间就是靠卖证券谋生的。

Because I've faced that, and I sold securities for a while.

不过在一九五六年五月,我家里有几位亲戚——我那时候刚从 New York 回来——他们想让我帮他们打理股票。之前我去 New York 工作以前,也帮过他们。

But in May of 1956, I had a number of members of my family— I'd come back from New York, and they wanted me to help them out with stocks, as I had earlier before I'd taken a job in New York.

我就说,我不想做股票销售那一行,但我自己很喜欢投资。

And I said I did not want to get in the stock sales business, but I wanted to— I enjoyed investing.

我也很愿意想办法用这种方式来做,后来我就是通过 partnership 这种形式来做的。

I was glad to figure out a way to do it, which I did through a partnership form.

但如果我觉得真的有任何可能会把钱亏掉,我是不会这么做的。

But I would not have done that if I thought there was any chance really that I would lose the money.

我担心的不是我自己会怎么做,而是他们会怎么反应。

And what I was worried about was not how I would behave, but how they would behave.

因为我需要的是能和我步调一致的人。

Because I needed people who were in sync with me.

所以,一九五六年五月,我们跟七个人一起坐下来吃晚饭,这七个人要么是我的亲戚,要么有一位是我大学时的室友和他母亲。我把 partnership agreement 给他们看,然后我说,你们其实不用读这个。

So when we sat down for dinner in May of 1956 with 7 people who either were related to me or one was a roommate in college and his mother, and I showed them the partnership agreement, I said, you don't need to read this.

你知道,我在这个 agreement 里不可能搞什么花样——反正这种东西,你们也不用找 lawyer 来看。

You know, there's no way that I'm doing anything in the agreement that there's any way that— You don't need a lawyer to read anything of the sort.

不过我说,这里有一些基本原则,说明我觉得我能做什么,以及我希望别人怎么评价我。

But I said, here are the ground rules as to what I think I can do and how I want to be judged.

如果你们和我是同样的想法,我就愿意替你们管钱,因为那样我就不用担心,一旦市场下跌,或者别人跟你们说了点不一样的话,你们就会恐慌。

And if you're in sync with me, I want to manage your money because then I won't worry about the fact that you will panic if the market goes down or somebody tells you something different.

所以我们必须想法一致。如果我们想法一致,那我就不担心替你们管理资金。

So we have to be on the same page, and if we're on the same page, then I'm not worried about managing your money.

但如果我们想法不一致,我就不想替你们管钱,因为当我觉得这时候反而更值得继续投资时,你们可能会很失望,诸如此类。

And if we aren't on the same page, I don't want to manage your money because you may be disappointed when I think that things are even better to be investing in and so on.

所以我觉得,你自己也应该有一套基本原则,知道你的预期是什么,什么时候他们该给你送玫瑰,什么时候又该朝你扔砖头。

So I think you ought to have your own ground rules as to what your expectations are, when they should send you roses and when they should throw bricks at you.

总之,你们得在同一页上。

And you want to be on the same page.

这也是为什么我从来没有——我们那个 partnership 里一个 institution 都没有,因为—— institution 就意味着 committee,而 committee 又意味着——

And that's one reason I never— we didn't have a single institution in the partnership because— institutions meant committees, and committees meant that—
M2
M222:47

你有几个很信任你的姨妈。

You had some aunts that trusted you.
M1
M122:49

你说什么?

What's that?
M2
M222:50

你有几个很信任你的姨妈。

You had some aunts who trusted you.
M1
M122:52

对,没错,还有一个岳父把他在这个世界上拥有的一切都交给了我。不过——只要他能一直跟我站在一起,不会被新闻标题之类的东西吓得惊慌失措,我就不介意接下他全部的钱。

Yeah, well, and a father-in-law that gave me everything he had in the world, you know, but— and I didn't mind taking everything he had in the world as long as he would stick with me and wouldn't get panicked by headlines and that sort of thing.

所以,非常——这是极其重要的一点:不要接受那些对你有你根本做不到的期待的人。

And so it's very— it's enormously important that you don't take people that have expectations of you that you can't meet.

这就意味着你得拒绝很多人。

And that means you turn down a lot of people.

也就是说,你大概要从很小的规模开始,然后做出一份经过审计的业绩记录。

It means you probably start very small and you get an audited record.

等到你有了那种信心:如果连你自己的父母来找你,要把他们所有的钱都交给你投资,你都能对他们说,我未必能拿到最好的业绩,但我可以保证,长期来看,你们会得到一份体面的业绩。

And when you've got the confidence where if your own parents came to you and they were going to give you all their money and you were going to invest for them, you've got the kind of confidence that you'll say, I may not get the best record, but I'll be sure that you get a decent record over time.

到了那个时候,你才算准备好了,可以真正去做。

That's when you're ready to go on it.
M2
M223:39

我给你讲个故事吧。我经常把这个故事讲给一些年轻 lawyer 听,他们常来问我,怎么才能不做律师了,改行去当 billionaire?

Let me tell you a story that I tell young lawyers who frequently come to me and say, how can I quit practicing law and become a billionaire instead?

所以我就说,这让我想到一个他们讲 Mozart 的故事。

And so I say, well, it reminds me of a story they told about Mozart.

有个年轻人去找他,说,我想写 symphony,我想跟你聊聊这个。

A young man came to him and he said, I want to compose symphonies and I want to talk to you about that.

Mozart 就问他,你多大了?

Mozart said, how old are you?

那个人说,二十二岁。

And the man said, 22.

Mozart 就说,你太年轻了,还写不了 symphony。

And Mozart said, you're too young to do symphonies.

然后那个人说,可你十岁的时候就在写交响乐了。

And the guy says, but you were writing symphonies when you were 10 years old.

他说,是啊,但我可没有到处跑去问别人这是怎么做的。

He says, yes, but I wasn't running around asking other people how to do it.
M1
M124:23

Carol,我们祝你一切顺利,而且——

Carol, we wish you well, and—.

但是——

But—.

还有我们——

And we—.

其实,我们真的是这么想的,因为你会问这种问题,在某种程度上说明你一开始的态度就是对的。

And actually, we really do, because the fact you ask that sort of a question is, to some extent, indicative of the fact you got the right attitude going in.
M2
M224:40

想成为一个伟大的投资者,可没那么容易。

It isn't that easy to be a great investor.

早上好,Buffett 先生,Munger 先生。

Good morning, Mr. Buffett, Mr. Munger.

我叫 J.C.。

My name is J.C.

我十一岁,来自中国。

I am 11 years old, and I come from China.

这是我第二年来参加这个会。

This is my second year at the meeting.

Munger 先生,继二月份的 Daily Journal 会议之后,很高兴再次见到您。

Mr. Munger, it's great to see you again after the Daily Journal meeting in February.

Buffett 先生,您提到过,年纪越大,就越能理解人性。

Mr. Buffett, you mentioned that the older you get, the more you understand about human nature.
M1
M125:08

您能不能再详细讲讲,您都学到了什么?还有,人性上的这些差异,怎么能帮助您做出更好的投资?

Could you elaborate more about what you've learned, and how can the differences of human nature help you make a better investment?

我也想请 Munger 先生也评论一下这个问题。

I would also like Mr. Munger to comment on that, please.

非常感谢。

Thank you very much.

嗯,你应该等 Charlie 来回答,因为他年纪更大。

Well, you should wait for Charlie's answer because he's even older.

关于变老这件事,他甚至能比我讲得更多。

He can tell you more about being old than I can even.

这绝对是真的,不管你用什么标准来看,我都在走下坡路。

It's absolutely true that virtually any yardstick you use, I'm going downhill.

而且,那个,你知道,如果我现在去考 SAT,再跟我二十出头时的分数比一比,我觉得那会相当尴尬。

And the, you know, if I would take an SAT test now and you could compare it to a score when I was in my early 20s, I think it'd be quite embarrassing.

而且当然——Charlie 和我都能给你举很多例子,当然还有一些我们就不告诉你了,就是人随着年龄增长,很多方面会怎么衰退。

And it's certainly— Charlie and I can give you a lot of examples, and there are others we won't tell you about, how things decline as you get older.

不过我想说的是,在我看来,随着你年纪变大,你确实可以,也应该更懂人类行为。

But I would say this, it's absolutely true in my view that you can and should understand human behavior better as you do get older.

因为你在这方面就是有了更多经验。

You just have more experience with it.

而且我不认为你能靠读书——Charlie 和我年轻的时候,只要是我们感兴趣的主题,几乎每一本书我们都读。

And I don't think you can read— Charlie and I read every book we could on every subject we were interested in, you know, when we were very young.

而且我们光是通过研究别人的人生,就学到了非常非常多。

And we learned an enormous amount just from studying the lives of other people.

但是我不觉得你真的能——我不觉得你光靠读书就能成为人类行为方面的专家,不管你的 IQ 有多高,也不管老师是谁。

But I don't think you can really— I don't think you can get to be an expert on human behavior at all by reading books, no matter what your IQ is, no matter who the teacher is.

而且我认为,你确实会在人类行为这件事上学到很多。

And I think that you really do learn a lot about human behavior.

有时候,你得通过一次又一次的亲身经历来学。

Sometimes you have to learn it by having multiple experiences.

我觉得你会——我其实觉得,尽管我有各种别的不足,我现在心算没有以前快了,读书也没有以前快了,但我确实觉得,我对人类行为的了解,比我二十五岁或者三十岁的时候多得多。

I think you'll— I think I actually think I, despite all the other shortcomings, and I can't do mental arithmetic as fast as I used to, and I can't read as fast as I used to, but I do think that I know a lot more about human behavior than I did when I was 25 or 30.
M2
M227:34

如果你想要一句 mantra,那它来自一位刚刚去世的华人绅士,Lee Kuan Yew,他可能是世界历史上最伟大的建国者。

If you want one mantra, it comes from a Chinese gentleman who just died, Lee Kuan Yew, who was the greatest nation-builder probably that ever lived in the history of the world.

他这一辈子反反复复一直在说一句话:搞清楚什么有效,然后就去做。

And he said one thing over and over and over again all his life, figure out what works and do it.

你的人生只要带着这种简单的理念去过就行了,这是你自己理性思考得出来的一套东西。

You just go at life with that simple philosophy from your own rational group.

你会发现,这样做效果特别好。

You will find it works wonderfully well.

搞清楚什么有效,然后就去做。

Figure out what works and do it.
M1
M128:05

所谓搞清楚什么有效,意思就是要弄明白别人是怎么行为处事的。

Figuring out what works means figuring out how other people behave.

当然。

Of course.

Charlie 和我,以很多意想不到的方式,看到了人类行为中最极端的一面。

Charlie and I have seen the extremes in human behavior in so many unexpected ways.
M2
M228:21

现在我们每天晚上都能看到,人类行为的各种极端表现。

Now we get it every night, extremes of human behavior.

你要做的就是把电视打开。

All you got to do is turn on the television.
M1
M128:29

对,我很高兴他用了这个例子。

Yeah, I'm glad he used that example.

好,Becky。

Okay, Becky.

下面是一个关于科技,还有我们现在最大持仓公司的问题。

Question on technology and the company's biggest holding now.

既然 Apple 现在已经是我们最大的持仓了,跟我们多讲讲你的想法吧。

Given that Apple is now our largest holding, tell us more about your thinking.

你怎么看这家公司面临的监管挑战?

What do you think about the regulatory challenges the company faces?

比如说,Spotify 已经在欧洲以反垄断为由对 Apple 提起了投诉。

For example, Spotify has filed a complaint against Apple in Europe on antitrust grounds.

Elizabeth Warren 提议结束 Apple 对 App Store 的控制,这会影响这家公司提升服务业务的战略。

Elizabeth Warren has proposed ending Apple's control over the App Store, which would impact the company's strategy to increase its services business.

这些批评公平吗?

Are these criticisms fair?

这个嘛,还是那句话,我们不——不过我可以告诉你,你提到的这些点我都知道,而且我非常喜欢我们持有的 Apple。

Well, again, we're not— I will tell you that all of the points you've made, I'm aware of, and I like our Apple holdings very much.

我是说,它是我们最大的持仓。实际上,对 Apple 这个案例来说,真正让人难受的是股价涨了。我们其实更希望这只股票——我不是说要对它做什么——但我们其实更希望它价格低一点,这样我们就能买更多。

I mean, it is our largest holding, and actually, what hurts in the case of Apple is that the stock has gone up, and we'd much rather have the stock— and I'm not proposing anything be done about it— but we'd much rather have the stock at a lower price so we could buy more stock.

还有很重要的一点,如果 Apple——我想他们前两天又授权了七百五十亿美元,不过就假设他们未来三年要花一千亿美元回购自己的股票。

And importantly, if Apple— I think they authorized another $75 billion the other day, but let's say they're going to spend $100 billion in buying in their stock in the next 3 years.

你知道,这个道理非常简单。

You know, it's very simple.

如果他们按每股两百美元回购,那他们能买回五亿股。

If they buy it at $200, they're going to get 500 million shares.

他们现在外面流通的大概是四十六亿股,所以在那种情况下,最后就会变成四十一亿股。

They've got 4 billion, 600 million out now, and so they'll end up with 4.1 billion under that circumstance.

如果他们按每股一百五十美元回购,那就能买回六亿六千七百万股。这样一来,相比第一种情况我们原来会拥有的比例,现在——分母就会低于四十亿股,而我们持有的比例就会更高。

If they're buying it at $150, they'd buy in 667 million shares, and instead of owning what we would own in the first case, we'd now— the divisor would be less than 4 billion, and we'd own a greater percentage of it.

所以实际上,很大一部分利润,至少是有这个授权了——会被用来在我们一分钱都不用掏的情况下提高我们的持股比例,这正是我喜欢看到的,这是一门很棒的生意。

So, in effect, a major portion of earnings, at least possibly— it's at least been authorized— will be spent in terms of increasing our ownership without us paying out a dime, which I love for a business, a wonderful business.

而最近这个变化,也就是股价大幅上涨,从长期来看其实对 Berkshire 是不利的。

And the recent development, when the stock has moved up substantially, actually hurts Berkshire over time.

当然我认为我们还是会做得不错,但我们不会去——我们不会把我们对 Apple 的预期掰开揉碎地讲出来,毕竟说不定明天就有人要跟着我们买。

We still do, in my opinion, we'll do fine, but we're not going to get into— we're not going to dissect our expectations about Apple, you know, for people who may be buying it against us tomorrow or something.

所以我们不会白白把这方面的投资建议送出去,不过你提到的这些事情,显然我们都知道。

So we don't give away investment advice on that for nothing, but all the things you've mentioned, obviously, we know about.

我们还知道一些——我们还有一大堆别的变量会一起纳入考量,而且我们也很高兴它是我们最大的持仓。

We know some— we've got a whole bunch of other variables that we crank into it, and we like the fact that it's our largest holding.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M2
M231:18

嗯,在我们家里,那些用 Apple 手机的人,最后才会放弃的就是它。

Well, in my family, the people who have Apple phones, it's the last thing they'll give up.
M1
M131:27

这东西持有着可不赖。

Not a bad item to have.

还有一样我们也不会放弃,那就是午饭。现在我们先休会,等到一点左右再继续。

And the other thing we won't give up is lunch, and we'll now adjourn and we'll reconvene at 1 o'clock or thereabouts.

咱们待会儿见。

I'll see you a little later.

嗨,Warren、Charlie。

Hi, Warren and Charlie.

我叫 Rob Lee,来自加拿大 Vancouver。

My name is Rob Lee from Vancouver, Canada.

你们能不能跟我们分享一下,你们最看重的是什么——呃,就是——

Could you please share with us what do you value the most in— Well, you know—
M2
M232:03

我倒是希望我能多一点。

I'd like to have a little more of it.
M1
M132:10

有两样东西是你花钱买不到的,时间和爱。我很早就一直很珍惜这两样,而且我这一生非常非常非常幸运,能够在极大程度上掌控我自己的时间。

It's the 2 things you can't buy, time and love, and I valued those for a long time, and I've been very, very, very lucky in life in being able to control my own time to an extreme degree.

Charlie 也一直很看重这个。

Charlie's always valued that too.

所以我们当初真的想要有钱,就是为了能在生活里基本上想干什么就干什么。

That's why we really wanted to have money, was so we could do what we damn pleased, basically, in our life.

不是为了六栋房子、船之类的那些东西。

It wasn't 6 houses or boats or anything.

当然,Charlie 是有一条船,不过那对我们也没多大用。

Well, Charlie's got a boat, but it doesn't do us that much good.

但时间很宝贵,而且——我们非常非常幸运,因为我们做的工作里,体力好不好根本没什么差别。

But time is valuable, and that's— and we are very, very lucky to be in jobs where physical ability doesn't make any difference.

而且你知道,对我们这种身体在慢慢变老的人来说,这工作简直再合适不过了,我们每天都能做自己热爱的事。

And, you know, we've got the perfect job for a couple of guys with aging bodies, and we get to do what we love to do every day.

我的意思是,字面上说,凡是钱能买到的东西,我基本上都可以买,但我做现在这件事得到的乐趣,比做任何别的事都更多。Charlie 还在设计 dormitories。

I mean, I literally, I could do anything that money could buy pretty much, and I'm having more fun doing what I do than doing anything else, and Charlie is designing dormitories.

我是说,他的人生很有意思,而且他也给这种生活带来了很多内容。

I mean, he's got an interesting life, and he brings a lot to it.

他现在一周读的书,还比我一个月读完的都多,而且他还记得自己读了什么。

He still reads more books in a week than I get done in a month, and he remembers what he reads.

所以我们的处境已经非常好了,但我们的时间也不是无限的。不管做什么,只要能腾出时间去做我们喜欢做的事,我们俩这一生都已经把这点发挥到最大了。

So we've got it very good, but we don't have unlimited time, and whatever we do to free up the time to do what we like to do, and we've both maximized that in our lives.

确实是这样。

We do.
M2
M233:46

任何人要是能幸运到把时间花在自己真正喜欢做的事情上,那就很了不起了。

Anybody's lucky if he gets so that where he spends his time at, he really likes doing.

那是一种福气。

That's a blessing.
M1
M133:57

是啊,我们这一生真是运气太好了,简直让人难以置信,首先就是出生在 United States。

Yeah, we've had so much good luck in life, it sort of blows your mind, starting with being born in the United States.

顺便说一句,Canada 也挺好的。

Canada would be fine too, incidentally.

我可不想得罪任何人。

I don't want to offend anybody.

Buffett 先生、Munger 先生,感谢你们回答我的问题。

Mr. Buffett and Mr. Munger, thank you for taking my question.

我叫 Firoz Qayyum,来自加拿大的 Mississauga,现在住在 New York。

My name is Firoz Qayyum, and I'm from Mississauga in Canada and now live in New York.

我的问题是,怎样才能最好地效仿你们,在建立自己的能力圈方面取得成功。

My question is how to best emulate your success in building your circle of competence.

考虑到现在的投资环境比你们刚开始的时候竞争激烈得多,如果让你们现在来建立自己的能力圈,你们会不会有什么不同的做法?

Given the environment today in investing is a lot more competitive than when you started out, what would you do differently, if anything at all, when building your circle?

你们还会建立一个非常宽泛的通才型框架吗?还是会把重点放得更深、但更窄一些,比如专注某些行业、某些市场,甚至某一个国家?

Would you still build a very broad generalist framework, or would you build a much deeper but narrower focus, say, on industries, markets, or even a country?

如果是的话,哪些会让你感兴趣呢?

And if so, which ones would interest you?

谢谢。

Thank you.

对,你说得没错,现在的竞争确实比我刚开始那会儿激烈得多。

Yeah, well, you're right, it is much more competitive now than when I started.

而你会——

And you would—.

我刚开始的时候,我真的可以拿着 Moody's Industrial Manual、Moody's Banks and Finance Manual,一页一页地翻,至少把每家公司都过一遍,想想哪些值得我进一步研究。

When I started, I literally could take the Moody's Industrial Manual, the Moody's Banks and Finance Manual, and I could go through page by page and at least run my eyes over every company and think about which ones I might think more about.

这很重要。

It's important.

我就是会做大量、大量的阅读。

I would just do a lot, a whole lot of reading.

我会尽量去了解尽可能多的企业,学到尽可能多的东西,然后我会去判断,哪些企业是我确实拥有一些重要认知和理解的,而且这种理解很可能和绝大多数竞争对手都不一样。

I'd try and learn as much as I could about as many businesses and I would try to figure out which ones I really had some important knowledge and understanding that was probably different than overwhelmingly most of my competitors.

我也会努力搞清楚哪些是我不懂的,然后我会专注于尽可能扩大我的能力圈,同时也尽可能现实地判断,我的能力圈边界到底在哪里。

I would also try and figure out which ones I didn't understand, and I would focus on having as big a circle as I could have and also focus on being as realistic as I could about where the perimeters of my circle of competence were.

我在一九五一年一月见到 Lorimer Davidson 的时候,我就知道,我能搞懂 insurance。

I knew when I met Lorimer Davidson in January of 1951, I could get insurance.

我是说,那个周六我跟他待了三四个小时,他说的话对我来说特别有道理。

I mean, what he said made so much sense to me in the 3 or 4 hours I spent with him on that Saturday.

所以我就深入研究了,然后我发现我能理解它。

So I dug into it and I could understand it.

我的脑子在这方面很好使。

My mind worked well in that respect.

但我不觉得我能搞懂 retailing。

I didn't think I could understand retailing.

我唯一做过的,就是在跟 Charlie 同一家 grocery store 干过活,而我们俩对 retailing 都没学到太多,除了知道这活儿比我们喜欢的要辛苦。

All I'd done was work for the same grocery store that Charlie had, and neither one of us learned that much about retailing except it was harder work than we liked.

你也得做同样的事,而且你现在面对的竞争要大得多。

And you've got to do the same thing, and you've got way more competition now.

但如果你能在一个哪怕相对小的领域里,比别人懂得更多,而且你不会老是有一种非得频繁出手的冲动,

But if you get to know even about a relatively small area, more than other people do, and you don't feel a compulsion to act too often.

你就只是等,等到胜算明显站在你这边的时候再行动。

You just wait till the odds are strongly in your favor.

这依然是个非常有意思的游戏。

It's still a very interesting game.

只是它比以前更难了。

It's harder than it used to be.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M2
M237:05

嗯,我觉得,对绝大多数人来说,正确的策略是专注于某个专门领域。

Well, I think the right strategy for the great mass of humanity is to specialize.

没人会想去找那种一半是 proctologist、一半是 dentist 的医生。

Nobody wants to go to a doctor that's half proctologist and half dentist.

你知道,所以——所以普通人想要成功,通常的办法就是做很窄的专业化。

You know, and, and well, and the— so the ordinary way to succeed is to narrowly specialize.

Warren 和我其实并不是这么做的,我们没这么做,是因为我们更喜欢另一种方式的活动,但我不觉得我们可以把这个推荐给别人。

Warren and I really didn't do that, and that— and we didn't because we, we prefer the other type of activity, but I don't think we can recommend it to other people.
M1
M137:38

对,在我们那个年代,更像是在寻宝,而且宝藏其实很容易看出来。

Yeah, it was a little more treasure hunting in our day, and, and it was easy to spot the treasure.
M2
M237:42

我们是把它做成了,但那有点像——对,这不是一条标准路径。

We made it work, but it was kind of a— yeah, it's not the standard way to go.
M1
M137:49

至少我自己最理解的行业,其实是 insurance。

The business, at least I best understood, actually was insurance.

我是说,我——而且我当时几乎没什么竞争对手。

I mean, I— and I had very little competition.

而且你知道,我会——比如说我去 Pennsylvania 的 Harrisburg 的 insurance department,我记得有一次我特地开车去那儿,就是为了查一家 Pennsylvania 的公司,那时候你还不能在 internet 上拿到所有这些信息。

And, you know, I would— if I went to the insurance department in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, I remember one time I drove there just to check on some Pennsylvania company, and this is when you couldn't get all this information on the internet.

我进去之后问了一家公司的情况,那个人就说,你是第一个来问这家公司的人。

And I went in and I asked about some company, and the guy said, you're the first one that's ever asked about that company.

而且资料也不多。

And there wasn't a lot.

我还去过 Hudson Street 上的 Standard & Poor's 图书馆,我想他们当时是这么叫的吧,我会去那儿找这些很冷门的资料。

I went over to the Standard & Poor's library on Hudson Street, I guess they called it, and I would go up there and ask for all this obscure information.

那儿也没什么人坐着。

And there wasn't anybody sitting around there.

他们摆了不少桌子,你可以坐在那里看资料,大概是这样,对。

They had a bunch of tables that you could sit at, maybe, yeah.

所以竞争就少一些。

So it was less competition.

不过如果你哪怕只有一件事懂得特别透,到了某个时候,它也会给你带来优势。

But if you know even one thing very well, it'll give you an edge at some point.

你知道,就像 IBM 的 Tom Watson Sr. 说的,我不是什么天才,但我在某些点上很聪明,而且我就待在那些点附近。

You know, it's what Tom Watson Sr. said at IBM, you know, I'm no genius, but I'm smart in spots, and I stay around those spots.

这基本上就是 Charlie 和我努力在做的事,我觉得你大概也可以这么做,不过你会发现那个范围其实非常小。

And that's basically what Charlie and I try and do, and I think that's probably what you can do, but you'll find it's so small.
M2
M239:05

对,我们在几个领域都是这么做的。

Yeah, we did it in several fields.

这很难。

That's hard.
M1
M139:10

而且我们也有过几次被狠狠教训的时候。

And we got our head handed to us a few times too.
F1
F139:14

Warren,你一直大力提倡指数投资,也提倡不要试图择时市场,但 Berkshire 持有这么大量的现金和 T-bills,在我看来,你这有点说一套做一套。

Warren, you are a big advocate of index investing and of not trying to time the market, but by your having Berkshire hold such a large amount of cash and T-bills, it seems to me you don't practice what you preach.

我在想,一个不错的替代方案是,在你找到有吸引力的收购机会或者回购股票之前,把 Berkshire 大部分多余现金投到一个分散得很好的指数基金里。

I'm thinking that a good alternative would be for you to invest most of Berkshire's excess cash in a well-diversified index fund until you find an attractive acquisition or buy back stock.

如果过去十五年你这么做了,同时始终保留你想要的两百亿美元现金缓冲,我估算到二零一八年年底,公司原本那一千一百二十亿美元的现金、现金等价物和短期 T-bills 投资,价值本来会变成大约一千五百五十亿美元。

Had you done that over the past 15 years, all the time keeping the $20 billion cash cushion you want, I estimate that at the end of 2018, the company's $112 billion balance in cash, cash equivalents, and short-term investments in T-bills would have instead been worth about $155 billion.

这两个数字之间的差额,代表的机会成本相当于 Berkshire 当前账面价值的百分之十二以上。

The difference between the 2 figures is an opportunity cost equal to more than 12% of Berkshire's current book value.

你对我这个说法有什么回应?还有——我刚才忘了——我补充一下,这个问题来自 Mike Elsasser,他在佛罗里达州 Boca Raton 的 Colony Group 工作。

What is your response to what I say, and for— I forgot to— I'll say the question is from Mike Elsasser, who is with the Colony Group located in Boca Raton, Florida.
M1
M140:25

这是个完全合理的问题,我也不想跟这些数字争。

That's a perfectly decent question, and I wouldn't quarrel with the numbers.

我会说,这确实是一种可选方案。比如说,我的继任者将来可能会想采用,因为总体来说,我宁愿持有指数基金,也不愿意拿着 Treasury bills。

And I would say that that is an alternative, for example, that my successor may wish to employ, because on balance, I would rather own an index fund than carry Treasury bills.

我会说,如果我们在二零零七年或零八年就实行这种政策,那到了二零零八年末或二零零九年,我们在出手能力上可能就会处在不同的位置。

I would say that if we'd instituted that policy in 2007 or '08, we might have been in a different position in terms of our ability to move late in 2008 or 2009.

所以,当你管理的是几千亿美元的时候,这里面会有一些执行层面的问题;如果你是拿十亿美元、二十亿美元来做类似的策略,那就不一样了。

So it has certain execution problems with hundreds of billions of dollars than it does if you were having a similar policy with $1 billion or $2 billion or something of the sort.

不过这是个非常理性的观察,当然了,回头看这十年的牛市,这一点确实会特别显眼。

But it's a perfectly rational observation, and certainly looking back on 10 years of a bull market, it really jumps out at you.

但我会说,如果你操作的是更小的资金规模,这么做会非常有道理。

But I would argue that if you were working smaller numbers, it would make a lot of sense.

如果他们管理的是大规模资金,那 Berkshire 未来用这种方式运作,也很可能是有道理的。

And if they're working with large numbers, it might well make sense in the future at Berkshire to operate that way.

你知道,我们一个星期前刚承诺投了 一百亿美元,而且在某些情况下——这些情况并不遥远,只是不是说在任何一个星期、一个月或者一年里都很可能发生——但在某些情况下,我们是可以花出去一千亿美元的。

You know, we committed $10 billion a week ago, and there are conditions under which— and they're not remote, they're not likely in any given week or month or year— but there are conditions under which we could spend $100 billion.

而且会非常非常快。

Very, very quickly.

如果我们真这么做了,如果那些条件出现了,那资本的配置效果会非常好,也会比放在指数基金里好得多。

And if we did, if those conditions existed, it would be capital very well deployed and much better than in an index fund.

所以我们的运作基础是,我们会等到部署资本的机会出现。

And so we're operating on the basis that we will get chances to deploy capital.

这些机会很可能会成堆出现,而且会出现在别人不想配置资本的时候。

They will come in clumps in all likelihood, and they will come when other people don't want to allocate capital.

Charlie,你怎么看这个问题?

Charlie, what do you think about it?
M2
M242:33

嗯,我承认,在持有现金这件事上,我确实比很多人更保守一点,不过——我觉得这没什么不对。

Well, I plead guilty to being a little more conservative with the cash than other people, and— but I think that's all right.

事后用二零二零的眼光来看,我们本来可以把所有钱投进很多证券里,它们的表现都会比 S&P 更好。

We could have put all the money into a lot of securities that would have done better than the S&P with 20/20 hindsight.

要记住,在那整段时期里,我们一直都持有那么多额外现金。

Remember, we had all that extra cash all that period.

如果到时候出现什么机会之类的情况。

If something can come along in the way of opportunities and so on.

我不认为,像我们这么大的公司,现金头寸保持得更强一点是什么罪过。

I don't think it's a sin to have to be a little strong on cash when you're as big a company as we are.

我们没必要——我亲眼看着 Harvard 把他们最后一点现金都用上了,连家长预付的学费都算进去,在最错误的时点一头扎进市场,还对 private equity 做了很多远期承诺,结果他们痛苦了差不多两三年,简直是煎熬。

We don't have to— I watched Harvard use the last ounce of their cash, including all their prepaid tuition from the parents, and plunge it into the market at exactly the wrong moment and make a lot of forward commitments to private equity, and they suffered like 2 or 3 years of absolute agony.

我们不想变成 Harvard 那样。

We don't want to be like Harvard.
M1
M143:25

再加上 timber,还有一大堆别的东西。

Plus timber and a whole bunch of things.

我的意思是,再加上 timber,我是说——

I mean, plus timber and I mean—.
M2
M243:28

对,对,我们不会改的。

Yeah, yeah, we're not going to change.
M1
M143:37

我们确实喜欢手里有很多钱,这样我们就能动作非常快,而且出手非常大;我们不会——也许也不会——我们知道,这种机会不会经常出现。

We do like having a lot of money to be able to operate very fast and very big, and we don't— and maybe we won't— we know we won't get those opportunities frequently.

我觉得——当然,你知道,未来二十年或三十年里,总会有两三次,简直像天上下黄金一样,你只要走到外面去捡就行了。

I don't think— certainly, you know, in the next 20 or 30 years, there'll be 2 or 3 times when it'll be raining gold and all you have to do is go outside.

但我们不知道那些时刻什么时候会发生,而我们有很多钱可以投入。

But we don't know when they will happen, and we have a lot of money to commit.

我会这么说,如果你告诉我,我必须要么持有短期 Treasury bills,要么买 index funds,让那笔钱就这么广泛地投资在 America,我会选 index funds。

And I would say that if you told me I had to either carry short-term Treasury bills or have index funds and just let that money be invested in America generally, I would take the index funds.

但我们还是抱有希望。

But we still have hopes.

你们有一点一定要非常明确地了解 Berkshire:我们经营这家公司的方式,是我们认为符合这样一类股东利益的——他们几乎把自己全部净资产都放在了 Berkshire。

And the one thing you should very definitely understand about Berkshire is that we run the business in a way that we think is consistent with serving shareholders who have virtually all of their net worth in Berkshire.

我自己刚好就是这种情况,不过不管在什么情况下,我都会这么做。

I happen to be in that position myself, but I would do it that way under any circumstances.

有很多信任我们的人,如果按照标准的投资做法来看,他们持有的 Berkshire 占自己净资产的比重,其实高得不成比例。

We have a lot of people who trust us who really have disproportionate amounts of Berkshire compared to their net worth if you were to follow standard investment procedures.

我们当然希望为每个人赚钱,但我们更想非常非常确定的一点是:对于那些一开始在接近企业内在价值的价位买入我们股票的人,我们不要让他们任何人遭受永久性的亏损。

And we want to make money for everybody, but we want to make very, very sure that we don't lose permanently money from anybody— for anybody that buys our stock somewhere around intrinsic business value to begin with.

我们就是很反感这样一种情况:我们有一百多万股东,也许多到两百万,而其中很多人如果愿意跟我们待上一段时间,最后却真的亏了钱。

We just have an aversion to having a million-plus shareholders, maybe as many as 2 million, and having a lot of them ever really lose money if they're willing to stay with us for a while.

我们也知道,当整个世界都动荡不安的时候,人们会怎么做——他们想依靠某样东西,而我觉得他们想依靠的是那种像 Gibraltar 巨岩一样稳的东西,我们确实很倾向于去实现这个目标。

And we know how people behave if— when the world generally is upset and they want to be with something, I think they want to be with something that they feel is like the rock of Gibraltar, and we have a real disposition toward that goal.

你好,Warren。

Hi, Warren.

你好,Charlie。

Hi, Charlie.

我叫 Carrie,这是我女儿 Chloe。

My name is Carrie, and this is my daughter Chloe.

她十一周大。

She's 11 weeks.

这是她第一次参加 Berkshire 股东大会。

It's her very first Berkshire meeting.

我们来自 San Francisco,我们有一个关于就业的问题想请教你。

We're from San Francisco, and we have a question on employment for you.

作为一家大型雇主,同时也是消费品生产商,你怎么看 automation 和临时就业上升之下,优质全职工作的前景充满不确定性这件事?

As both a major employer and a producer of consumer goods, what do you make of the uncertain outlook for good full-time jobs with the rise of automation and temporary employment?

嗯,如果我们在两百年前问这个问题,呃,要是有人说,随着农用机械、拖拉机、联合收割机之类的发展,农场上百分之九十的人都要失去工作,呃,那看起来会很可怕,不是吗?

Well, if we'd asked that question 200 years ago, uh, and somebody said with the outlook for development of farm machinery and tractors and combines and so on, meaning that 90% of the people on farms were going to lose their job, uh, it would look terrible, wouldn't it?

但是我们的经济、我们的人民、我们的制度,一直都表现得极其有创造力,才能实现我们今天拥有的一切——现在大概有一亿六千万个工作岗位——而从一七七六年以来,在这整个过程中,我们其实一直都在想办法消灭工作岗位。

But our economy and our people, our system, has been remarkably ingenious in achieving whatever we have now, 160 million jobs, when throughout the period ever since 1776, we've been figuring out ways to get rid of jobs.

这就是资本主义的作用,它会让人均产出越来越多的商品,而这些东西到底会从哪儿冒出来,我们事先也永远没法完全知道。

That's what capitalism does, and it produces more and more goods per person, and we never know exactly where they're going to come from.

我的意思是,嗯,如果你当时做的是客运火车那一行,那你也知道,那肯定是会变的。

I mean, well, if you were in the passenger train business, I mean, you know, that was going to change.

但是在这个经济体系里,我们总能找到办法雇用越来越多的人。到现在为止,全国就业人数已经比这个国家历史上任何时候都更多了。尽管一家公司接一家公司,尤其是重工业那类行业,一直都在想办法——这也很正常——怎么不断提高生产效率。也就是说,用更少的人生产出同样数量的商品,或者用同样的人生产出更多商品。

But we find ways in this economy to employ more and more people, and we've got now more people employed than ever in the history of the country, even though company after company and particularly in heavy industry, that sort of thing, has been trying to figure out, naturally, how to get more productive all the time, which means churning out the same number of goods with fewer people, or churning out more goods with the same number.

这就是资本主义。

That is capitalism.

我觉得你不用担心 American ingenuity 会枯竭。

I don't think you need to worry about American ingenuity running out.

我的意思是,你看看各行各业里的人,他们当然喜欢赚钱,但他们也真的很喜欢创新发明。

I mean, you look at people in all kinds of, I mean, businesses, and they like to make money, but they really like to be inventive.

你知道,他们就是喜欢做点事情。

You know, they like to do things.

而这个经济体制,它是行得通的。

And this economy, it works.

它会继续行得通。当然,对某些行业来说会非常艰难,也会出现各种错位和冲击。

It will continue to work, and it will be very tough in certain industries, and there will be dislocations.

等汽车出来以后,我们就不会再生产那么多马蹄铁之类的东西了。但现在我们还是能找到办法,去雇用现在这多少来着,一亿五千五百万,不管具体是多少,总之就是这么多人,同时支撑起三亿三千万人口。

We won't be making as many horseshoes and that sort of thing when cars come along and all that, but we do find ways now to employ whatever we're employing, 155, whatever it is, million people, and supporting a population of 330 million people.

而我们一开始全国只有四百万人口,那时候百分之八十的劳动力都在农场干活。

When we started with 4 million people, with 80% of the labor being employed on farms.

所以这个制度是有效的,而且它会继续有效。

So this system works, and it will continue to work.

至于下一个大机会会是什么,我不知道。

And I, I don't know what the next big thing will be.

但我知道,一定会有下一个大机会。

I do know there will be a next big thing.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M2
M249:14

嗯,我们想尽可能把那些脏活累活转交给机器人去做。

Well, we want to shift the scut work to the robots to the extent we can.

正如 Warren 说的,这两百年来我们一直就是这么干的。

That's what we've been doing, as Warren said, for 200 years.

没人想回去当铁匠,或者沿着街一边走一边铲马粪,或者干以前那些乱七八糟的活。

Nobody wants to go back to being a blacksmith or scooping along the street, picking up the horse manure, or whatever the hell people used to do.

那些工作被淘汰掉,我们是高兴的。

We're glad to have that work eliminated.

而很多对未来的担忧,来自左派人士。他们特别担心经济金字塔底层的人,只是在顶部的人跑得更快的时候,稍微跟着改善了一点。

And a lot of this worry about the future comes from leftists who worry terribly that the people at the bottom of the economic pyramid have had a little stretch when the people at the top got ahead faster.

那种情况是个意外,因为当时我们麻烦太大了,不得不向全世界放水,把利率一路压到零。

That happened by accident because we were in so much trouble that we had to flood the world with money and drive interest rates down to zero.

当然,这就把资产价格推高了,也帮到了富人。

And of course, that drove asset prices up and helped the rich.

没人那么做是因为突然爱上了富人。

Nobody did that because they suddenly loved the rich.

那只是个意外,而且很快就会过去。

It was just an accident, and it will soon pass.
M1
M150:10

我们就是想要这种生产率提升。我们没必要因为 Charlie 和我当年在杂货店工作过就担心什么。那时候人家要买一罐豌豆,我们得爬梯子上去把那罐豌豆拿下来,然后放进一个可以折叠的箱子里,再把它装上卡车。

We want to have all this productivity improvement, and we shouldn't worry a little about the fact that Charlie and I, we worked in a grocery store, and when people ordered a can of peas, we had ladders that we climbed up to reach the can of peas, and then we placed it in a folding box, and then we put it on a truck.

如果你看看从生产者到消费者之间,真正被转运的食品数量,再看看这笔交易里一共卷入了多少人,你就会发现,那时的效率——我也不知道该说是现在最佳配送方式的三分之一、四分之一,还是五分之一——反正远远不如现在把食物送到你手上的最好办法高效。

And if you looked at the amount of food actually transferred between the producer and the person who consumed it, and the number of people involved in the transaction, you know, it was—I don't know whether it was 1/3 or 1/4 or 1/5 as efficient as the best way now to get food delivered to you.

而且那时候的食物还更差。

And the food was worse.

对,我祖父当时就对这种赊账加送货上门的店要被淘汰这件事很难受。后来它确实被淘汰了,但社会进步了。

Yeah, and my grandfather would, you know, was distressed about the fact that this particular credit and delivery kind of store would be eliminated, and it was eliminated, but society progressed.
M2
M251:10

现在又回来了。

It's coming back.
M1
M151:11

你说什么?

Pardon me?
M2
M251:12

它又回来了。

It's coming back.
M1
M151:13

它是回来了,不过效率更高了。

It's coming back, but more efficiently.
M2
M251:14

对,对,对。

Yeah, yeah, yeah.
M1
M151:17

不管怎么说,我们也看到了一点创造性破坏。坦白讲,我们还挺高兴的,因为这让我们腾出手来进入投资业务。

Anyway, we've seen a little creative destruction, and frankly, we're glad that it freed us up to go into the investment business.

对我们来说,结果反而更好。

It worked out better for us.

Becky?

Becky?

过去这几年,在 Berkshire 的年度股东信里,关于旗下运营业务和财务表现提供的细节越来越少了。

For the past several years, in Berkshire's annual shareholder letter, there's been increasingly less detail provided on its operating businesses and financial performance.

比如说,公司现在不再提供 finance and financial products 这个分部的详细信息,也不再提供 manufacturing、service 和 retail 分部的资产负债表,保险业务里按各个单位拆分的 float 明细也没有了。

For example, the company is no longer providing details on the finance and financial products segment, or a balance sheet for the manufacturing, service, and retail segment, or a breakdown of float by unit in the insurance business.

像 Berkshire 这么大、业务这么多元化的公司,为什么投资者现在拿到的信息,反而比以前更少了呢?

For a company as large and diversified as Berkshire, why are investors being provided less information than previously?

嗯,我不认为我们实际上提供的信息更少了。

Well, I don't think we actually provide less information.

我们可能只是每年用的呈现方式有些不一样。

We may present it in a somewhat different form from year to year.

就拿今年来说吧,你知道,我像往常一样,在脑子里开始写这封信的时候,是想着“亲爱的 Doris 和 Bertie,我的姐妹们”,想的是把我会告诉任何一个把自己净资产里很大一部分投在 Berkshire 的人该知道的事告诉她们。

Just this year, for example, I, you know, I started my letter as usual in my mind as saying, dear Doris and Bertie, my sisters, to tell them what I would tell anybody that had a very significant proportion of their net worth in Berkshire.

她们是聪明人,但不懂我们各种业务里的那些行话;不过因为她们投得很多,所以会愿意读很多文字。

Who was intelligent, did not know all the lingo of our various businesses, that would read a lot of words because they did have a large investment.

所以如果我把事情解释清楚,而且讲得还不错的话,她们就能明白我在说什么。

So if I explained anything and did a decent job, that they would understand what I was talking about.

我会用我认为容易理解的语言去告诉她们,也就是让那一百多万、而且对会计之类的东西理解程度各不相同的人里,相当大一部分都能听懂。

And I tell them that in the language that I think will be understandable to a significant percentage of a million-plus people who have all kinds of different understanding of accounting and all that sort of thing.

我会告诉她们,如果我是站在对面、作为股东,我自己想听到的信息。

I tell them information I would want to hear on the other side.

当然,如果我是竞争对手,想知道我们某一家家具店赚了多少钱之类的,你知道,我可能会很喜欢这些信息,但如果你谈的是一家五千亿美元规模的机构,这其实并没有什么真正的意义。

Now, if I was a competitor and I wanted to know what one of our furniture stores was earning or something of the sort, you know, I might love it, but it doesn't really make any difference if you're talking about a $500 billion organization.

如果你理解我们的保险业务,从给大家建立整体图景这个角度来说,我觉得用三页、四页、五页,其实就够了。你知道,关于 loss reserve development,SEC 还要求我们披露一大堆内容。

If you understand our insurance business, and in terms of giving you the picture, I think in 3 or 4 or 5 pages, you know, actually we've got a whole bunch of stuff that's required by the SEC about loss reserve development.

我觉得你完全可以写出一份三百页的报告,但它传递的信息反而比一份五十页的报告少得多,而且还会把人看晕。

I think you can write a 300-page report that gives a whole lot less information than a 50-page report, and you lose people.

所以我还是尽量像我说的那样,在我脑子里,把读者当成我的姐妹们。

So I try to tell them, like I say, in my mind, it's my sisters.

我会尽量告诉她们,如果这是我们的一家私人企业,她们每个人各拥有三分之一,我也拥有三分之一,那我会怎么跟她们讲。

I try to tell them what I would tell them if we had a private business and they owned a third of it each and I owned a third.

一年一次,她们希望了解一下情况,但她们不知道 combined ratio 是什么意思,因为那就是个大家都在用的蠢术语。

Once a year, they like to get filled in and they don't know what a combined ratio means because it's a dumb term that everybody uses.
M2
M254:05

这很重要。

It's important.
M1
M154:06

那就叫 profit margin 好了。

Call it a profit margin.

她们也不知道铁路业务里的 operating ratio 是什么,那也是个过时的术语。

They don't know what the operating ratio is in the railroad business, and it's an obsolete term.

把它叫成 profit margin 会更好。

It'd be better to call that a profit margin.

但这些行话——我们写这封信不是写给分析师看的。

But the lingo—we're not writing it for analysts.

我们是写给股东看的,我们是想告诉他们一些东西,让他们能把这些信息拼起来看明白。

We are writing it for shareholders, and we're trying to tell them something so they can make an addition.

这样他们不仅能看清我们现在拥有什么,也能明白我们是怎么思考经营的、我们长期想做什么,而我们每年也都在尽力把这件事做好。

They can not only get the picture as to what we own now, but how we think about the operation, what we're trying to do over time, and we try to do the best job we can every year.

而且我不认为——我觉得如果有人对那些细枝末节特别感兴趣,那他其实是错过了整体图景。因为你完全可能在一九六五年就知道我们纺织业务的每一个细节,我们也可以告诉你,衬里面料赚了多少、手帕赚了多少,但那会是另一个世界里的事情。

And I don't think it—I think if somebody is terribly interested in the details, they really are missing the whole picture, because you could have known every detail of our textile business in 1965, but we could give you the information how much we made from linings and how much we made from handkerchiefs, and it would be in a different world.

我的意思是,重要的是我们怎么看待替别人管钱这件事,以及随着时间推移,我们会怎么处理各种情况。

I mean, the important thing was how we looked at running money and what we would do about things over time.

而且——如果你在一九八零年或者八五年读那份东西,又想从里面找 See's Candies 经营得怎么样的很多细节,还有他们往东扩张时的情况,你就很容易被带偏。你知道,我们会告诉你,总体来说,他们在扩展地域这件事上是失败了;但如果要展开讲一大堆细节,那对分析师来说可能很有意思,可对股东来说,真正要做的决定,是谁在替他们管钱,这些人是怎么管的,过去长期做了什么,未来希望做什么,以及该怎么衡量这些事。

And it just— you could have gotten very misled if you'd read it in 1980 or '85 and you looked for great detail on how See's Candies was doing, and as they moved eastward, you know, we'll tell you that overall that failed in terms of moving out the territory, but going into a whole lot of detail that might be very interesting to an analyst, but really for the shareholder, they've got to make a decision as to who's running their money and how they're running it and what they've done over time and what they hope to do in the future and how to measure that.

而且再说一遍,我们写这个是给个人投资者看的。

And again, we're writing it for the individual.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M2
M255:56

嗯,我想,按说我应该盯着每一家小业务,连最后一分钱都不放过,但我没有,而且我也不想要那么多细节。

Well, I suppose I should be watching every tiny little business down to the last nickel, but I don't, and I don't want that much detail.

我觉得我们的竞争对手倒是会很喜欢那些细节,但那对我们的股东没什么好处。

And I think our competitors would like it, and it wouldn't do our shareholders any good.

所以我们大概还是会继续按现在这种方式来做报告。

So we'll probably just keep reporting the way we do.
M1
M156:14

你们看得出来,我们这儿是很灵活的。

You can see how flexible we are here.

你们两位真的是一对传奇搭档,我从小就非常佩服你们的投资策略。

You two make up an iconic duo, and growing up, I found your investment strategies very admirable.

所以我的问题是,当你们两个人之间出现分歧的时候,你们是怎么处理冲突的?

And so my question is, how do you deal with conflicts when they arise between the two of you?

Charlie 和我,真的是——很多人很难相信——但六十年来,我们从来没吵过架。

Charlie and I literally— and people find this hard to believe— but in 60 years, we've never had an argument.

我们当然也会有意见不一致的时候,而且以后大概也还是会偶尔有分歧。

We have disagreed about things, and we'll probably keep occasionally disagreeing.

可能是这件事,也可能是那件事;但如果你把争吵定义成那种开始带上情绪、带上怒气或者类似东西的情况,那这种事从来没有发生过。

About this or that, but if you define an argument as something where emotion starts entering into it or anger or anything of the sort, it just doesn't happen.

我觉得 Charlie 比我聪明,但我也觉得,有些事情我花的时间比他多,所以有时候我们俩都会觉得自己是对的。一般来说,最后还是按我的办法来,因为 Charlie 愿意那样做;而且如果后来事情做错了,他从来不会事后质疑我。同样,如果是他在做某件事,后来结果证明错了,我也根本不会去事后质疑他。所以一直以来就是这样。

I think that Charlie is smarter than I am, but I also think that there are certain things where I've spent more time on them than he has, and sometimes we both think we're right. Generally, I get my way because Charlie is willing to do it that way, and he's never second-guessed me when things have been wrong, and I wouldn't dream of second-guessing him if he were doing something that was wrong, so it turned out to be wrong.

基本上,我们永远不会发生冲突。

We will never have a conflict, basically.

Charlie?

Charlie?
M2
M257:27

嗯,问题不在于我们相处了多久——也不在于我们怎么相处。

Well, the issue isn't how long— how we get along.
M1
M157:31

问题在于这套合作方式是怎么运作的。我们很幸运,你知道,我是在二十八岁的时候碰到他的。我们俩都在同一家 grocery store 工作过,而且他从小长大的地方,离我现在住的地方还不到一个街区之远,诸如此类。不过在我二十八岁之前,我根本不知道 Charlie Munger 是谁。

The issue is how this is going to work. We're lucky that, you know, I ran into him when I was, what, 28 years old, and we'd both worked in the same grocery store, and he grew up less than a block away from where I now live and everything, but I did not know who Charlie Munger was until I was 28.

但很显然,我们看世界的方式是同步的,在商业决策上,基本上也是一致的。

But clearly, we're in sync in how we see the world, and we're in sync on business decisions, basically.

Charlie 会比我做得更少一些,但那是因为我的时间都花在这个上面,而他可能在设计 dormitories 之类的东西。

Charlie would do fewer things than I would, but that's because I'm spending my time on this while he's designing dormitories or something.

我们俩都用各自的方式让自己忙起来,而且像现在这样分工合作,我们也乐在其中。

And we both keep busy in our own ways, and we have a lot of fun dividing the labor like we do.

不过你真的,你真的还是要去工作。

But you really, you really want to work.

我的意思是,人生里有合适的搭档,尤其是合适的配偶,但更广义地说,有合适的人生伙伴,这件事极其重要。

I mean, having the right partners in life, particularly the right spouse, but particularly having the right partners in life is enormously important.

我是说,不管在个人生活里还是在商业生活里,有搭档都会更有意思,而且你大概也能做成更多事,不过最重要的是,你会过得更开心。

I mean, it's more fun with a partner, both in personal life and in business life, and you probably get more accomplished too, but you just have a better time.

如果只是一个人待在小房间里工作,赚了很多很多钱,那一点都不好玩。

It would not be any fun to do work in a little room and make a ton of money.

整天倒腾 securities,却从来不跟另一个人一起共事。

Trading around securities, but never working with another human being.

所以我建议去找——嗯,Charlie 在那部电影里给过建议,找那个愿意接纳你的最好的人,诸如此类。

So I recommend finding— well, Charlie gave some advice in the movie, finding the best person who will have you or something like that.

算是个比较有限的目标吧。

Sort of a limited objective.
M2
M259:09

不过,如果你是个收藏家,而且钱一直没花光,那要过得开心其实并不难。

But it's not hard to be happy if you're a collector and don't run out of money.

收藏本身就天然——你想想看,在你这一辈子认识的人里,那些搞收藏、而且钱也没花光的人,有几个在收藏这件事上是不开心的?

Collecting is intrinsically— just think, how many people who you know in your whole life who were collectors who didn't run out of money, who weren't happy collecting?

这就是我们这一辈子一直在积累的东西。

That's what we've been collecting all our lives.

这是一件很有意思的事。

It's a very interesting thing.

总会有新的石头等着你翻开看看,而且很有意思。

There's always a new rock to be turned over, and it's interesting.
M1
M159:40

对,而且我们当然也结交了很多朋友,让我们的生活变得更好,跟他们在一起我们也很开心。

Yeah, and certainly we've collected friends that make our lives better, and that we have a good time with.

你选择谁作为自己的榜样,或者选择谁做朋友,这非常重要,我在这方面一直很幸运。

It's very important who you select as your heroes or your friends, and I've been lucky in this.

我的意思是,要不是一位叫 Eddie Davis 的医生和他的太太,Charlie 和我甚至都不会认识。

I mean, it was only because of a doctor named Eddie Davis and his wife that Charlie and I even met.

不过如果你做的事情足够多,总有一些会有好结果。

But if you keep doing enough things, some will work out.

非常幸运。

Very lucky.

这本书叫《The Man Who Knew Nothing》。

The book is called The Man Who Knew Nothing.

最好的那种,还是那些能和别人保持一辈子联系和交往的关系。

The best ones are ones that involve lifelong involvement with other people.

我们有一些董事,好几位董事,都对我产生过类似的影响。

We've got some of our directors, a number of our directors, that have had similar impacts on me.

所以我建议你去找一个比你更优秀的人,然后努力让自己变得像他们那样。

So I recommend that you look for somebody better than you are and then try to be like they are.
M2
M260:29

这很有意思,你知道,这一路上我们也失去过一些人。

It's funny, you know, we've lost people along the way.

当 Warren 的秘书离开我们的时候,我心想,天哪,她太好了,Gladys。

When I lost Warren's secretary, I thought, my God, she was so wonderful, Gladys.

我们再也找不到第二个了。

We'll never get another one.

结果 Becky 更好。

Becky is better.

后来我们还有 Vern McKenzie,他是一位非常出色的 chief financial officer。

And then we, we had Vern McKenzie, who was a wonderful chief financial officer.

他也不在了,而现在接任的这位更好。

He's gone, and the current incumbent is better.

我们一直都非常幸运,也许股东们还会再多幸运几次。

We've been very lucky, and maybe the shareholders will be lucky a few more times.
M1
M161:00

好,八号提问区。

Okay, station 8.

嗨,Warren。

Hi, Warren.

嗨,Charlie。

Hi, Charlie.

我叫 Jacob。

My name is Jacob.

我是来自中国的股东,同时也是 Columbia Business School 的自豪毕业生。

I'm a shareholder from China and also a proud graduate of Columbia Business School.

感谢你们让我们来到这里。

Thanks for having us here.

我的问题是,和四十年前相比,我们今天这个世界变化得更快,而且未来还会更快。

My question is, our world is changing at a faster pace today versus 40 years ago, and even more so going forward.

在这样的背景下,对我们每个人来说,我们是应该随着时间不断扩大自己的能力圈,还是应该守住现有的能力圈,但同时承担可投资范围越来越小的风险?

Under this context, for each of us individually, shall we expand our circle of competence continuously over time, or shall we stick with the existing circle but risk having a shrinking investment universe?

谢谢。

Thank you.

嗯,很显然,你应该——不管在什么情况下,你都应该扩大自己的能力圈。

Well, obviously, you should— under any conditions, you should expand your circle of competence.
M2
M261:47

前提是你做得到。

If you can.
M1
M161:48

如果你做得到的话。

If you can.

对。

Yeah.

这些年我的能力圈确实稍微扩大了一点,不过——

I've expanded mine a little bit over time, but—.
M2
M261:56

你不能——你还是应该相当谨慎。

You can't— you ought to be pretty cautious.
M1
M162:01

你没法硬来。

You can't force it.

如果你跟我说,我非得变成一个 physics 方面的专家,或者——

If you told me that I had to become an expert on physics or—.
M2
M262:12

比如跳舞,也许去当芭蕾舞的领舞。

Dance, maybe the lead in the ballet one.

那场面可有得看了。

That would be a sight.
M1
M162:18

对,不过那也算一种。

Yeah, well, that's one of them.
M2
M262:20

尤其是现在。

Particularly now.
M1
M162:21

那可能是你在想的一个例子,但我压根没想到那个。

That's one you may be thinking about, but that didn't even occur to me.

不过对,这很荒唐。

But yeah, it's ridiculous.

但这不代表你一点都不能扩大它。

That doesn't mean you can't expand it at all.

我的意思是,我一路走来,确实也在一些业务上学到了些东西。

I mean, I did learn about some things as I've gone along in a few businesses.

有些情况下,我学到的是自己并不胜任,这其实反而是件好事,这样你就把那一项排除了。

In some cases, I've learned that I'm incompetent, which is actually a plus, and you've discarded that one.

不过这并不会真的——这个世界总是在变化。

But it doesn't really— the world is going to change.

而且会一直变下去。

It's going to keep changing.

它每天都在变,这也正是有意思的地方。

It's changing every day, and that makes it interesting.

随着变化发生,当然,在你认为属于你现有能力圈的范围内,你应该是那个最能把它搞明白的人,不然那其实就不算你的能力圈。

As it changes, certainly within what you think is your present existing circle, you should be the master of figuring that one out, or it really isn't your circle of competence.

如果你在前进过程中有机会把它稍微扩大一点,我跟 Walter 和 Greg 一起工作时,确实从他们那里学到了一些 energy business 的东西,但我离他们那种水平的胜任程度还差得远。

If you get a chance to expand it somewhat as you go along, I've learned some about the energy business from Walter and Greg as we work together, but I'm not close to their level of competence on it.

但我确实比以前懂得更多了。

But I do know more than I used to know.

所以你还是有机会把它稍微扩展一点。

And so you get a chance to expand it a bit.

通常来说,我觉得一个人的核心能力,多半还是会跟他大脑运作的方式相契合。

Usually, I would think normally your core competence is probably something that sort of fits the way the mind is working.

有些人有我所谓的 money mind,他们在某些跟钱有关的情境里就会做得特别好。

Some people have what I call a money mind, and they will work well in certain types of money situations.

这倒不太是 IQ 的问题。

It isn't so much a question of IQ.

人的头脑是个很奇妙的东西,每个人都会有自己的专长,不管是在 chess 还是 bridge 上。

The mind is a very strange thing, and people have specialties, whether in chess or bridge.

我在不同的人身上都见过,有些人能做到那些——看起来几乎不可能做到的事,但在其他领域,他们又真的像 Charlie 会说的那样,有点愚蠢。

I see it in different persons, people that can do impossible— what seem to be impossible things, and they're really kind of, as Charlie would say, stupid in other areas.

所以就继续打磨它吧,但别觉得你非得把它扩大,于是就开始扭曲规则。

So just keep working on it, but don't think you have to increase it and therefore start bending the rules.